Transsexuals are up in arms against the Government after a minister failed to include them in her remarks agreeing the so-called ‘conversion therapy’ is harmful and should be illegal in a debate in the UK Parliament.
Homosexual activists are also in open revolt against the Government, with three advisers having quit the government’s LGBT+ advisory panel, the BBC reports, ‘amid concern it is being too slow in bringing in legislation.’
Auntie’s website goes on: ‘The controversial practice involves treatments ranging from psychotherapy to religious teaching and discussion.
‘Campaigners want a “meaningful” law against the practice, which aims to change sexual orientation or gender identity.’
Those resigning included professional lesbian Jayne Ozanne and pro-trans-sexual campaigner James Morton. But Business Secretary Kwasi Kwarteng MP said the government ‘bows to nobody in terms of our pushing for LBTQ issues, LGBT rights and also rights of minorities’. We have known for some time the Conservatives have a pro-sodomy agenda and Mr Kwarteng has articulated it.
Debate on ‘LGBT Conversion Therapy’
The debate, on Monday 8th March 2021, was headed ‘LGBT Conversion Therapy’. The Hansard report is here. It followed an online petition “Make LGBT conversion therapy illegal in the UK” which attracted 256,392 signatures.
They asked the Government to:
• make running conversion therapy in the UK a criminal offence
• forcing people to attend said conversion therapies a criminal offence
• sending people abroad in order to try to convert them a criminal offence
• protect individuals from conversion therapy
It’s not grammatical, but the bigger error is that not one MP came up with a single example of anyone being ‘forced’ to attend therapy or sent abroad.
Psalm 5:9 For there is no faithfulness in their mouth; their inward part is very wickedness; their throat is an open sepulchre; they flatter with their tongue.
‘Sickens’ petitioners
The petition concluded by denouncing ‘LGBT conversion therapy’ as ‘psychological and emotional abuse’, the ‘very thought’ of which ‘sickens me’.
Elliot Colburn, homosexual Conservative MP for Carshalton and Wallington, opened the debate, if it can be dignified as a debate at all.
No fewer than eighteen MPs queued up to denounce ‘conversion therapy’ and not one went along to voice any concern to the contrary about civil liberties, personal liberties or religious freedom. Perhaps as the motion was merely ‘That this House has considered e-petition 300976 relating to LGBT conversion therapy’ they are biding their time.
In any event, one MP after another moaned about things which either are not happening or therapies sought out by people who wish they did not have same-sex attractions. The latter group are non-people to the MPs. Their views, even their existence, are not worthy of respect in a democratic society, as some learned judge is sure to say soon.
Victoria law attacks Christianity
The bill goes further than one passed in Queensland last year. No MP praised the Queensland law in the debate on Monday. That’s because the Queensland law only prohibits harmful practices in healthcare settings.
The MPs, on the other hand, have people of faith in their sights. The Victoria ‘Change or Suppression (Conversion) Practices Prohibition Bill 2020′ (Text here) is much more to their liking.
Passed last month, its Section 3 outlaws ‘carrying out a religious practice, including but not limited to, a prayer-based practice, a deliverance practice or an exorcism.’ Nor does it matter if the person gives ‘consent’ or requests deliverance.
Acts 5:29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
Vile affections
A similar law in Malta from 2016 declares ‘no sexual orientation, gender identity or gender expression constitutes a disorder, disease or shortcoming of any sort’. But that is just the opinion of mortal men. The Bible expresses the eternal truth that same-sex desires are ‘vile affections’:
Romans 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: :27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
What if a person decides being homosexual is not God’s will for their life? Can they seek a prayer partner to stand with them? What if a number of them came together in a support group, rather like Alcoholics Anonymous, and were led in prayer by a minister? It looks as if the minister would be breaking the law, but possibly the whole bunch could be convicted of giving each other ‘a prayer-based practice’.
No wonder Australia’s ABC reported that Victoria Liberal MP, Bernie Finn, said he believed the state’s bill went too far. ‘This bill is an attack on basic freedoms, it is an attack on freedom of choice, it is an attack on free speech and it is an attack of freedom of association,’ Mr Finn said. He could have added ‘freedom of religion’.
Kemi: ‘Not an illness’
Replying for the Government, equalities minister Mrs Olukemi Badenoch said conversion therapy had ‘no place in a civilised society’, but added that ‘robust’ laws were already in place to deal with the most troubling examples, involving violence and sexual assault.
‘Put simply, being LGBT is not an illness to be treated or cured,’ she said ‘I am absolutely committed to ensuring that LGBT people can be truly safe and free to live their life as they wish,’ so long as they do not wish to be transformed and delivered from their sinful desires by the power of the Gospel, of course.
She assured us: ‘The Government have been clear that we do not intend to stop those who wish to seek spiritual counselling as they explore their sexual orientation, but there will be cases when a line is crossed, where someone is actively seeking to change another’s sexual orientation—an innate aspect of their personal identity—via coercion under the guise of spiritual support.’ But again, what if the ‘another’ is pleading to be set free from same-sex attraction?
Mental Health
‘It is clear that conversion therapy is associated with significant mental health problems and isolation from a support network. That, in turn, can lead to homelessness and abuse.’ But that is not true.
Firstly, homosexuality and trans-genderism are themselves associated with a raft of negative practices and mental health challenges.
Secondly, prayer in a church setting is being set free from a destructive ‘support network’ which reinforces sin and oppression, and finding another leading to redemption and freedom.
Mrs Balenoch asserted: ‘People will always have the right to seek support from anyone and have conversations to rationalise and understand their own identity. We will not restrict the right to seek counsel when needed, but that does not mean that we will tolerate the use of conversion therapy described in the debate. We are working to understand the impacts on wider rights and freedoms of any Government action to tackle conversion therapy. The legal landscape is complex, and we want to ensure that we get our proposals absolutely right.’
‘Engage with religious organisations’
Lastly, the minister said: ‘We will continue to engage with religious organisations and groups to understand how best support to LGBT people of faith. It is not the place of Government to dictate what is legitimate spiritual guidance, but it is the Government’s place to protect all their citizens.’ It would be good if the Government were also engaging with churches who take the Biblical witness seriously, because the Bible describes a programme of what we might today call ‘conversion therapy’ from all sorts of ungodly behaviour, and commends it:
1Cor 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
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Conversion therapy is an evil practice, my brother finally came out as gay at the age of 37 and he is finally happy in his life, married to a nice bloke and would do anything to help others that is a true Christian. I hope God spares your small minded soul.
@Paul2003
Who performed this so-called “conversion therapy” on your unlucky brother?
Every time I have asked those who want so-called “conversion therapy” to be banned in the UK for examples of this “evil practice” (as you call it), they have all failed to provide a single example of the therapy being offered in the UK. I’d come to the conclusion that there was more evidence of alien abductions than there was of conversion therapy and that banning alien abductions was therefore of a higher priority than banning conversion therapy.
Would you like to be the first person alleging conversion therapy to cite an example of it actually happening when I have asked for an example? I had concluded that the entire conversion therapy conspiracy theory was a hoax to fuel a witch hunt. Can you be the first to prove me wrong?
Paul, we don’t do insults here.
Paul, why are you a member of Christian Voice, if you are approving of homosexuality and believe God is, too?
Not everyone who comments is a member!
Well said, i hope your brother remains happy. I live with my partner and we are both very happy.
Of course you are. Fellowship is a good thing. What’s wrong with two blokes living together? Shades of Mortimer and Whitehouse gone fishing. or The Odd Couple. This is a business partner you live with, I take it?
Homosexuals are often ‘nice’ people – helpful and kind and their public works outshine some Christians. Satan was a deceiver from the beginning. He uses governments and media to make ‘abominations’ seem ‘normal’.
When I first learned of homosexuals through Wicker’s World BBC program in New York exploring what this new disease was predominantly amongst people practicing deviant sexual practices. Men lying with men as with women, I was horrified and disgusted that anyone should conceive such things, but now, a few decades on, I’ve learned to ignore it, or switch it off – it’s everyday parlance and is portrayed in soaps for entertainment, taught to young pre puberty children, and extolled for everyone to join.
How has society descended into this pit of iniquity? Why are ‘Gay Pride’ so vocal, why do they want to spread this abnormal behaviour? For the good of mankind? I was brought up to understand sexual activity is for procreation between married couples, God’s word says so. Now this blessing has become a curse.
Whatever kindness and helpfulness homosexuals may do, the gravity of their unnatural deeds, nevertheless, makes them unholy in God’s eyes –
‘Dead flies cause the ointment of the apothecary to send forth a stinking savour: so doth a little folly him that is in reputation for wisdom and honour.’ ECCLES. 10:1.
To be holy, a person must die to their flesh, and accept God fully.
The church is weak and not vocal enough on biblical words, the songs that are sung are often not biblical and people do not seem to use their time to read the Bible and pray.
There are people alive today who are proof of the fact that a gay person can become straight. If you disagree then watch “Once Gay – Matthew and Friends” at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSz7OHGuuwA
I agree Peter..thanks for your comment.
Blessings C
That is quite normal Peter. I had some of it in me through being sexually abused as a child by a so called housefather who was homosexual. I was not the only one by a long shot. I had conversion therapy. It’s called being converted to Christ and His ongoing work in one’s heart. Do they intend to legislate against Christ’s work? God finds ways around what man tries to stop.
God isn’t a meanie. He gives His laws for our protection and wellbeing. We all have freedom to choose to live by His laws or not.
People should have freedom to choose to have help to be free of homosexual attraction or any kind of sin, sexual or otherwise. To make it unlawful to have conversion therapy is an infringement on a person’s human rights. People should have the right to choose. My concern as a grandmother is that the LGBT lobby wants to force their way of being on everyone else… including young children. This makes me very angry.
I add it’s not for anyone to make God fit into their own personal liking in their own image which is sadly what so many do. This as an attempt to believe they are okay with God and to keep their sin. ..people do this to hold onto many forms of sin, not just sexual.
They cannot seem to stand anyone wanting to be free of it. Maybe it’s a guilt thing.
I suggest what we need in our interaction with our MPs, etc. is a guide on how best to approach them. This would need to focus on the definition of what is and is not “conversion therapy”. The Victoria (Australia) legal definition is very broad., and can be readily attacked. Adult consent is not a defence, It is OK to “assist” someone undergoing gender transition, but the implication is that this is only one way, away from the person’s genetically determined sex. Why should it not be legal to “assist” someone who wishes to transition back to aligning their gender identity with their sex? Forbidding praying with them is appalling. Where does pastoral care of someone struggling with their orientation or identity start and “conversion therapy” begin? It is very likely that Christians who engage in homosexual activity will struggle with that fact that the Bible unequivocally states that this is sinful. Filial and spiritual Love between those of the same sex is encouraged, erotic practice is forbidden. Celibacy is the only acceptable lifestyle. Councelling does not mean intentional conversion, but allowing them to explore the issue and make up their own minds. Similarly sex is devinely determined and those with gender dysphoria (unease, dissatisfaction) will need councelling and prayer, as would anyone with psychological issues.
For anyone (who may be a Christian?) asking about this issue, I think the simple answer is, “What does GOD say about it?”.
I watched and listened to this amazing guy, Sam Salter, on Christian Concern’s Roundtable discussion on Friday:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCMOz2qzF_M
Christian Concern say: Sam is one of many seeking therapy for unwanted same-sex sexual attraction. “I seek therapy because I think it’s the right thing to do. I haven’t been coerced,” he said. “It’s not about pushing something down, suppressing something. It’s about taking these feelings and learning that they’re a symptom of a bigger issue. I’m taking a symptom and filling it with healthier things. That’s all therapy and rehabilitation are.”
Well worth a listen!
These people are trying to impose an oppressive state on us similar to East Germany. My theory is this agenda is being imposed on us by Americans. I noticed the spokeswoman for the angry mob of women the other day was American as well. What seems to have happened is after the Cold War, the Americans and Soviets swapped positions. Where the Eastern block countries were liberated into free market economies, the Americans are trying to ban Christianity like the Soviets did. Unfortunately our country is under the thumb of Americans, like where there is a war lurking with China, the Americans have forced both sides of our house to support them in nuclear proliferation. All the characteristics of the Soviet Union are now to be seen there and also here. The sexual misfits is a part of the pantomime. They use them to brainwash us. Those who partake are the useful idiots.
The Conservatives have decided to be the opposite of conservative. They don’t conserve anything and their Government has now declared war on the all people of faith, not just Christians. I hope someone in the Tory party reads our posts because they need to understand that when a political group declares war on God there really is no future for them. Maybe that’s what they want.
I think you will find the Labour party even worse, politician s these days are only interested in themselves and how much money they can make.
You are right. Tony Blaire started all this by pandering to every minority, trying to gain their support?
If the some of LGBT community say that you can live as a Christian while actively homosexual, why are they so concerned when people read from the Bible? I want to say that there are Christians who exhibit pride. Now, scripture says that “God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble’. Do we take this as seriously as we do about the scriptures which speak of the evil of homosexuality? How do we treat prideful people? How do we treat LG BT people? Of course a huge issue is the verbal violence we get from the LGBT community towards Christianity. It is called Christaphobia. According to the Office of National Statistics, the LGBT community are about 2% of the population. 59% describe themselves as Christian. Hmmmm, where is democracy in what is happening? It seems that we must be tolerant towards their beliefs, but they are in no way tolerant towards the Word of God and His people. Banning ‘Conversion Therapy’, another new term created for the purpose, would do away the rights people who want to change have. Rights work both ways. Or does it?
There is a world of difference between passively accepting homosexuality or any other non normal sexuality. Nobody would want to return to the days when homosexuals were criminally persecuted.
But today, not a day passes without one or other of the myriad sexual conditions of man being powerfully promoted, often in wholly inappropriate circumstances, to children of ever more tender years. indeed we seem not far off the state where some form of non mainstream sexuality will be made compulsory.
I think you mean ‘criminally prosecuted’ and the problem is, activities are criminal that the state wishes should not happen.
The lifting of the threat of prosecution by the Sexual Offences Act 1967 unleashed the whole gay rights industry with its incessant demands and persecution of traditionalist dissidents that we see in the UK today. The nuance that the activities themselves remained illegal was lost.
The proponents of the Act claimed to hope homosexuals would comport themselves with dignity and not use its passing to flaunt themselves and their proclivities and expect more and more. Such self-control was never going to happen.
And if activities become legalised then the state wants them to happen and now the UK promotes these activities as ‘protected characteristics’ even among school-children and legalises gay marriage.
So, sadly but inevitably, decriminalisation leads inexorably to state promotion. It is all about direction of travel. Society is either moving towards Almighty God and his ways, and his blessings, or moving away. The UK is moving away. Many countries in the developing world are moving towards. They won’t be blessed and be prosperous overnight, but it will happen.